[RopeFiend]

I see you've found your way *here*, but how do you go about finding like-minded people near you?

Well, there's links on most of these forced forums to the others, but none of 'em are up for dating.

There's a handful of extreme dating sites, and a few free ways.  Undoubtedly I'll miss someone's favorite, so feel free to correct me and add your observations.  This is a biased review, by the way.

For 'pay' dating sites, there aren't any I'd recommend offhand.  Alt.com,  Dating.extreme-restraints.com and Bondage.com were all bought out by the annoying pricks at AdultFriendFinder, which has recently merged with Penthouse? Playboy?  (one of the two, anywise).  They'll let you set up a free profile, but you can't contact anyone.  That's about as useful as tits on a bull.  The forums at Bondage.com had been excellent, but in the last several months they've taken a severe downturn.  I used to have a paid profile at Bondage.com and a freebie at Alt.com, but the response rate was miserable.  From what I could tell, the profiles were either dead shills or had been copied from one of the other two AFF sites, and the message didn't go through or the person couldn't respond since they didn't have a paid account at Bondage.com.  Coming from AdultFriendFinder that wouldn't surprise me.  I finally dumped my Bondage.com account and edited my profile to send anyone bright enough to figure the link over to Collarme.com

The search engine at Collarme.com is pretty primitive.  However, it doesn't cost a dime.  If you're using a decent browser like FireFox (and why the hell not??) then you can block all of the advertising.   Collarme has people from ALL walks of the BDSM scene, from people casually interested to lifestylers.  So far, I've had probably 10 times the response rate from the people I tried to contact at Collarme, so there's fewer dead accounts or shills.  Since it's free, you get what you pay for.  Some of the people lie through their teeth on their profile, some are perverts looking to sucker you into sending naked photos, etc.  They're far in the minority.  The forums at Collarme were pretty spartan, but with everyone jumping ship from Bondage.com they've increased in volume and quality.  As far as actually finding someone in your area, it appears that a LOT of people are afraid to put their zipcode in their profile, so the 'find by distance' doesn't find everyone by a long shot.  Sigh.  In Texas that's a BIG problem, as they could be a 7 or 8 hour drive away, easily 3 or 4 hours out.  If you don't get any hits by distance, just use the STATE search.  You can browse without an account there, but to get the SORT BY DISTANCE to work you have to have a freebie so that it knows your zipcode.  You can use a one-time e-mail at mailinator.com if you prefer to stay anonymous, but I've never gotten any spam on the e-mail I used at Collarme.  The chat there is WAY better than at Bondage.com: there's plenty of 'em, and you can create your own room if you want to.

Another free option is OKCupid.com, also a free site.  Several of us have blatant BDSM profiles there, buried in a sea of vanilla people.  Again, the search is pretty pitiful, and won't let you filter by any of the most common limits or 'deal breakers'.  You can't search by SMOKING / NON-SMOKING which is pretty much a killer either way, but you can filter by RELIGIOUS BIGOT or RACIST.  How nice.  You'll see links to a handful of the OKCupid personality tests in the QUIZZES forum here, some even authored by Ray!  Again, it's mostly vanilla, but there's still quite a few Perverts from all over there.  Your mileage may vary.

I see a bunch of the younger gals on OKCupid saying "don't contact me unless you're at least an 80% match", which is silly.  Ignore the percentages.  If the other person looks interesting, GO ON A DATE.  You can't tell anything from the "advanced matching algorithm" that those Harvard geeks came up with.  A good friend and I have a low MATCH percentage and a high ENEMY percentage.  Guys and gals are different; get over it.  If you're looking for a match over 90%, then you'd better be flagging as LESBIAN 'cos you sure as hell aren't gonna find many honest GUYS that match you that high.  The secret to finding a good person is to DATE MORE.  Get the hell off of the computer and have a real date!

Yet Another free option is Craigslist.org.  They have separate sites for most of the major cities in the US, as well as the states and at least theoretical coverage for foreign countries.  Craigslist has a PERSONALS section that's pretty active here locally, although since it's free there seems to be a lot more trolls.  The non-US ones don't look very active.  There's NO filtering on Craigslist other than by age and the sub-section you're on (in my case, Dallas).

Something else to consider is your local munch.  A munch is a get-together of BDSM-friendly people in a non-threatening environment. They're usually held in a pub, cafe, bar or restaurant. You can come and go as you like within the times posted.  Dress is almost always vanilla so we don't scare the mundanes.  Times vary, but are generally in the evening weekdays or between lunch and evening weekends.  It's purely a 'meet and greet', usually with a meal although occasionally a 'carry-in' or potluck setup.  They're hosted by one of your local BDSM groups, and are a great way to meet other folks in the area looking to hook up.  The best link I have to locate a munch near you is http://ravishu.com/forums/index.php?topic=11019.msg63100#msg63100 for the folks here in the US.  Sorry, but I don't know of a similarly maintained list for other countries!  The Darkheart list is regularly updated, unlike some of the ancient and obsolete lists you'll find around the 'web.

Anyone interested in RavishU will probably have at least SOME points that will match up with any pervert interested in bondage.  Restraint and forced or 'loss of control' fantasies go hand-in-hand, although a lot of the bondage lovers I've met don't think about it that way until you club them over the head with it.  Leave off the 'R' word until you're comfy that you're interested in each other, and think you might want to take it further.

I'm open to suggestions!  Anyone have any other sites or meets I've missed?

[RopeFiend]

I just found a good list of the munches in the UK at http://www.informedconsent.co.uk/uk/munches/
and I'll edit in any others submitted into this post.

[Lois]

Thanks!  Gread post!

I soooo wanna get raped!

[RopeFiend]

And of course, don't forget the two sub-categories:

Study Partners Wanted for VRP

and

Victims/Rapists wanted for RLRP

[hrdman]

 Thanks very helpfull
will check out my local munch and post what i find, or who for that matter

[Gryphin_Rampant]

datehookup.com
Free
Links in profile to types of interests such as kink / bdsm / etc which will bring up other people with that word in the links section of their profile. 
Nice forums diviced by states / age etc.

Craigslist? Good luck. You need to know how to push people's buttons, post often, be well hung, under 40, and have disposable income.  Don't bother responding to postings unless you are really good at getting a woman's attention.  Use pictures but not overtly graphic ones.  Recognize spam.  Have several layers of email addresses to protect your privacy.  Post at least 4 times a day.  Read what other guys post and avoid looking like them.
There is more if you want to know.

[Carrie]

Post at least 4 times a day. 

I will disagree with that. I have used Craigslist and I was able to start seeing the serial posters -- mostly because they rarely changed their pictures or their banter. Made me avoid them like the plague.

[Gryphin_Rampant]

Carrie - While I understand your point your conclusion is not entirely correct.  I do agree not to post the same item 4 times a day.  You should post different subjects that can lead to the same results.  In Boston alone there are at least 3 other guys offering oral.  Each of us have our own phrases and we tend to respect the other guys 'patter'.  Most of us post daily.  The women I have met admit that they ignored a few of my more obvious ones until they were prepared to act on them if ever. 
An example of 4 posts that can lead to the same results:
* Daddy / daughter
* Dom / sub
* Generic role play
* Ravishment
I do agree that a lot of the posts seem to be by the same people.  Many of them are bots and some guys do not have the imagination to write their own stuff.  There is one more reason.  In general there are 100 listings per page.  Most of the women I have talked with stop reading after the first or maybe 2nd page.  If you post at 8AM, the odds are your posting will beon the 2nd page by 2:00.  In general the main reasons women contact me is for the quality of the post. The main reason they decline to go forward are: Penis size, Thickness of wallet (they won't even be taken to dinner), My height (5'8" is short), and location. (in that order).

Yes, one needs to be creative, know how to push buttons, try many different approaches depending on time of day, weather, and season.  And, yes, you do need to post several times a day.

[Carrie]

That does make sense, GR.

Actually, I don't believe I have ever answered an ad offering anything. I usually place the ad, looking for something very specific. I then have the dubious task of weeding through the HUNDREDS of responses I tend to get, deciding which respondent to go with.

The annoying part is that I tend to place very specific ads like wanting a guy who is at least 45 years of age with a full head of silver or grey hair and of certain ethnicity. And I get 25 year old boys trying to worm their way in.  I state that I want a man who can communicate with me -- that words and being talked to is a huge turn on so when I get someone who responds in "txt spk" or Twitterisms is immediately dismissed. There is no bigger turn off than, "U R Hot - how big R UR tits?"

[Gryphin_Rampant]

I forgot to preface my original posting with:
"Craig's List is free and worth every penny."
< huge bemused (yet empathetic) grin >
um, Ya, in the beginning I realized I didn't know what I was doing so I posted about 5 "women 4 men" ads.  That along with replying to what other men posted gave me a very clear idea of what - not - to do.  It's amazing how much that simple research helped me.  Some of the replies I received from responding to the men's postings were decidedly illuminating.  An insight to what women go through.  I owe much of my success to those exchanges.  

I have done the same things at Alt, match, yahoo personals, and singlesnet.  I chalk it, (the inane responces I received), up to "testosterone poisoning"
It is one of the many reasons I am glad I am not a woman.

[Lois]

There is no bigger turn off than, "U R Hot - how big R UR tits?"

 

Damn!  I've sure met that guy!

[Gryphin_Rampant]

There is no bigger turn off than, "U R Hot - how big R UR tits?"

 

Damn!  I've sure met that guy!

ya, and to think he sent me the same thing!  Oh, wait, that was spam.
----
Most of the postings I placed today in Boston:
----------
Masochist for: Dykes, Lesbians, FtMs and Straights - Sex Optional - m4w - 45 (Boston)
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cas/1492903511.html
Straight white male is available for abuse / torment / pain by any form of woman or FtM. Your size, shape, age (18+), and race can be of any nature. You must be doing this for your own pleasure regardless of mine. It can be an ongoing or just whenever you feel like it.

Straight women and novices are welcome.

Notes:
This is as much psychological as it is physical for me. It is not about the pain. It is about enduring it for you. I do not want this pain. I allow you to inflict it. I do not crave it. I simply permit it.

m4t - m4ww - m4w -
----------
Come Get Oral on This Warm November Day - m4w -
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cas/1492926435.html
----------
What Would You Do On a Dare? - m4w
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cas/1492913096.html
Yes? what would you do?
Show up, blow me and leave?
Whip me?
Give or get golden showers?
Come over and receive un-reciprocated oral?
Hand me your panties in the middle of a mall or on a street corner?

Or? You tell me.
----------
Lady is Invited to Perform Fellatio - m4w
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cas/1492940603.html
Good lady,
You are cordially invited to join me for the opportunity of performing fellatio upon me. You will be escorted to a warm sensual bedroom lit only by candles where in a position of your choosing you will be welcome to enjoy my penis to your complete contentment. If you like it can be covered in chocolate, honey, wine, or ? how would you prefer it?

My member is just the right size to give you the oral gratification you desire. It is clean, cut and healthy.
With great sincerity,
A gentleman

PS: I would love feedback even if you don't intend to avail yourself of this invitation.
----------
Safely Role Play - Dark Dolcett Cartoons - m4w
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cas/1493016903.html
You have had fantasies about the cartoons Dolcett drew. Would you like to safely role play a few of them?
----------
Would Love to Eat You for Lunch - m4w
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cas/1493085611.html
Come on over and enjoy being my lunchtime snack. You will love it.
----------
What Would You Like in Exchange for Your Panties? m4ww - m4w
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cas/1493096684.html
Name it. Anything except money / payment of any type is negotiable. They need to be a gift or a token of appreciation in exchange for something.
A glass of wine?
Massage?
A small favor?
Un-reciprocated oral?
Just the adventure of it?
A promise not to post this for a month?
I am open to suggestions.
----------
I am a Sadist. You are a Masochist.
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cas/1493100234.html
Any questions? I enjoy Dominating and inflicting pain.
Your limits will be respected.
Safe words are optional.
Sex can be used.
----------------------------
Come Get Oral on This Warm November Day - m4w
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cas/1492926435.html
Wouldn't you love a great! oral orgasm on such a fantastic day? Come and get it. I am waiting to provide a woman or two enormous satisfaction.
Available all day and late into the night.
Enjoy,
A man who loves giving oral to women.
--
Notes:
(yes, I know, I forgot it was December)
an FtM (female to male), post top surgery responded to this one.  I was succesful in getting him off.  He indicated that was not usually the case.
------------
You Resist. I Overpower You.
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cas/1489833767.html
Role Play - Fully Consensual.
There are many scenarios for this form of role play. They can range from fairly mild to rather extreme. It can be no more than starting naked and we struggle until penetration. It can be as complex as kidnapped from a bar, taken somewhere, ... In most cases it is you wear cloths that can be destroyed and you struggle as you are stripped and taken.

What would you like to try?
Safety Rules:
No kicking, punching, scratching, slapping etc to avoid injury.
--
Notes:
Received a reply but I think it is a guy looking for erotic chat or a woman yanking my chain since among other things after a few replies she evaporated when I sent my number and invited her to call.
----------
It is a very good day weather wise and people were in a good mood.  One woman, (er, guy), replied to two postings looking for kinky D/s erotic exchanges.  I made it clear I won't exchange email without a phone call and ideally a meeting.  I explained that there are too many fakes on CLCE and I didn't know if I was talking to a 14yo kid.  Her, um, his response was that she couldn't call or send pictures because her husband would catch her.  sure, right, whatever.

That was a very high reply day. .

[Carrie]

in the beginning I realized I didn't know what I was doing so I posted about 5 "women 4 men" ads.  That along with replying to what other men posted gave me a very clear idea of what - not - to do.  It's amazing how much that simple research helped me.  Some of the replies I received from responding to the men's postings were decidedly illuminating.  An insight to what women go through.  I owe much of my success to those exchanges.  

I have done the same things at Alt, match, yahoo personals, and singlesnet.  I chalk it, (the inane responces I received), up to "testosterone poisoning"
It is one of the many reasons I am glad I am not a woman.

GR, I commend you for this -- it is incredibly brave and shows amazing foresight to look into the "other side" of what we women deal with. It is a given that men and women think differently about sex and to investigate that aspect of the availability of impersonal connections from the womens perspective -- if you'll excuse the expression -- takes balls.

You might have a really interesting article or book worthy of writing there.

[Gryphin_Rampant]

Thanks Carrie,
Balls? Na, sensitivity, foresight, understanding, and compassion, ya, those help.   There was no inherent danger in placing a posting as a woman since I was not going to meet anyone.  As for inviting women to come to my place without meeting them first?  As a dyke lover once put it: I have "male privilege".  Basically I don't have to worry too much about being robbed or assaulted from someone on craigs list.  The women who have visited me indicate that they don't have any worries because of the electronic email / telephone trail and my location in a respectable condo complex.   Personally I think they are crazy. 

As for a book or article I have been encouraged a few times to write one and I have started more than once.  My biggest concerns are:
* I could make it look too safe
* I could make it look too easy
* Craig's List and other personals sights could get swamped with the wrong element using my techniques and people could get hurt / used / ...
While I would not be responsible for any outcome I would always wonder each time I heard of a misfortune if they were there because of me.
Oh, and one more reason: There is alwready enough competition on CL.  I don't want to spawn any more.
"On the web nobody knows you are a poodle"
One of the major down sides to CL are the players who deliberately respond with no intent of ever meeting.  They will jerk you around for 5 to 20 emails making excuses as to why they can't meet or call.  Some will even call (or get a female friend to call).  It takes a while before the pattern becomes obvious.  Any article / book on the subject would have to include a discussion about this phenomenon.  That could lead to even more people getting in on the game.
In fact, there is a similar hazards here at RavishU.  I have been contacted by 3 people here who claimed to be female and wanting cyber / instant messenger sex but would not call.  With ID blocking there is no reason not to call.  The work around is to take 3 very specific pictures that I request.  All can be done while holding a camera in one hand.  They need not show a face or any other identifying marks.

Life goes on.
Thanks again.

[Carrie]

I guess I wasn't thinking of the article/book as a "how to" but an investigation into the psychology of the entire lifestyle; what it is from the perspective of the man vs. the woman, why people do it, what their expectations are, what leads them to do such things, etc...

I have only engaged in the act in between relationships -- mostly in times of dire need. But I have encountered countless men who are unsatisfied in their relationships/marriages who are in physical need. I don't play those games, personally. I know how it felt to be lied to and cheated on and I would never want to be the "other woman" even if it is a one-time thing and the wife/partner never knows of my existence. That is a karma thing for me. Can't tell you how many married men I've turned down (not counting the fact that I'm sure I was lied to once or twice).

It is true that it is MUCH harder for a woman to engage in such activity; fear of attack or theft or some such things are pervasive. The few times I *have* agreed to meet with someone, I send as much information as I can about the person to a friend; I text him when I am about to meet someone for sex and if he doesn't hear from me within six or eight hours, he will check in on me.

It is also more difficult for women (at least for me), because many men have inflated egos about how good they are. Read the innumerable posts of men who claim to be good at cunnilingus. Most guys just want to get in and start off with mindless, porn-like jackhammer sex which gets really boring really fast. To find someone who is interested in hours of play is few and far between.

I had a handful of 15- and 30-minute men in the past year. All of them have continued to pester me for second encounters and I think I am just too polite to come out and tell them how mediocre I thought they were. As I said in another post, there was one guy who would at least give me two- and three-hours of pleasure before he would finish, but he has a 5" dick which still leaves me wanting.

I guess I'll continue to go unsatisfied...