[Strong in Heart]

Well, if a drunk man is raped...it is the rapist fault.  Him being drunk didn't make the rapist rape him.

The same goes for a drunk woman...if she is raped, it's STILL the rapists fault.

Now if the man is drunk and the woman is drunk, and the man rapes the woman...It's STILL the rapists fault.

And the same can be said in reverse.  If two men are drunk, and one rapes the other...it's STILL only the rapists fault.

It's not radical feminism to put the blame on the rapist, and we can do it no matter what gender.  If a man gets raped...it's still the rapist's fault.

To say that it is partially the victim's fault, no matter what gender, is just reason to be condescending.  It makes no logical sense.

If a man get's raped, no matter what, I will be the first to put ALL the blame on the rapist.

Let's try and keep it logical.

1 If BOTH parties are drunk it's notoriously hard to decide if rape took place at all. But certainly the idea that if both parties are drunk that only ONE is guilty is pretty illogical. Either both are or neither.

It's a question of the capability to consent.

And leaving aside misandrist nutters like McKinnon who think that women 'can't consent to sex' because of 'the unequal power relations between the sexes' if both parties are drunk in real life what actually happens is that NEITHER 'consents' in any meaningful sense of the word.

I KNOW: I've been there.

Not just my trauma at 18 but even after I'd often get drunk and then I and a strange man would find we'd fucked each other and neither of us even remembered much about it.

But (unlike my long weekend of brutal rape) I DIDN'T feel that I was being taken advantage of or that I had  NO responsibility for what happened.

[Withness]

I enjoyed this thread.  Thank you everybody for your thoughts.

Well, if a drunk man is raped...it is the rapist fault.  Him being drunk didn't make the rapist rape him.

The same goes for a drunk woman...if she is raped, it's STILL the rapists fault.

Now if the man is drunk and the woman is drunk, and the man rapes the woman...It's STILL the rapists fault.

And the same can be said in reverse.  If two men are drunk, and one rapes the other...it's STILL only the rapists fault.

It's not radical feminism to put the blame on the rapist, and we can do it no matter what gender.  If a man gets raped...it's still the rapist's fault.

To say that it is partially the victim's fault, no matter what gender, is just reason to be condescending.  It makes no logical sense.

If a man get's raped, no matter what, I will be the first to put ALL the blame on the rapist.

Let's try and keep it logical.

1 If BOTH parties are drunk it's notoriously hard to decide if rape took place at all. But certainly the idea that if both parties are drunk that only ONE is guilty is pretty illogical. Either both are or neither.

It's a question of the capability to consent.

And leaving aside misandrist nutters like McKinnon who think that women 'can't consent to sex' because of 'the unequal power relations between the sexes' if both parties are drunk in real life what actually happens is that NEITHER 'consents' in any meaningful sense of the word.

I KNOW: I've been there.

Not just my trauma at 18 but even after I'd often get drunk and then I and a strange man would find we'd fucked each other and neither of us even remembered much about it.

But (unlike my long weekend of brutal rape) I DIDN'T feel that I was being taken advantage of or that I had  NO responsibility for what happened.

This is completely true. In the U.S. military, servicemembers are told that if a man and woman go out and have a drink together and they have sex, the man is guilty of rape. Period.

The fact they both had drinks is irrelevant. If the woman had a lower BAC at the time...irrelevant. If she initiated it...irrelevant. If they both drank any amount of alcohol, the woman is no longer able to consent, and yet somehow the man is.

Now on this thread, it's been rightly pointed out that makes no sense. However, thanks to the radical feminists, this is the standard that is pushed.

[liarsuk33]

Second, I think people's rules for what rape is, vary from person to person. And I don't think this is just for rape, this applies to a lot of things. I know people for whom they are cool with all kinds of roughhousing, back slapping, and all of that, even from fairly recent acquaintances. I know other people who, if you slapped them on the back, you'd lose the hand, an eye, and a testicle before you heard the sound of the back slap. I've heard women say that they would castrate a guy if he looks at them wrong, I've heard women say that it isn't a good night at the club if they don't pass out drunk and wake up with a dick inside of them. Everybody's standards for everything is not the same.

This is the problem for us human beings, isn't it? Logic can't be applied universally throughout the law; because which  factors would be admitted and which would not - and who is to judge?  Strong in Heart made a lot of sense to me because if you choose to drink, knowing that alcohol severely diminishes your ability to reason and ability to defend yourself (like run like fuck or at least not walk into a bad situation), and then maybe  send out encouraging signals to a potential rapist because you're too rat arsed to act responsibly, a little (not most, obviously) of the blame could be apportioned to you. We seem to live in a world where it's always some other bastards fault, responsibility is someone else's job (lawyers usually).
Life is a series of shades of grey, it's rarely black or white.

[liarsuk33]

Just a footnote, today it's reported that in the UK rape complaints have doubled in the last five years, but the percentage of convictions has actually dropped.

I hate that false accusations can ruin a man's life.

A woman never has to worry about being falsely accused. Not like a man can falsely admit to raping a woman to tarnish the woman's reputation.

A woman can also get away with making false accusations because the legal system and society in general isn't really made to deal with them being made in the first place.

[PenitentGirl]

Yes we do.

As funny as it sounds, I am a feminist and I definitely do think there is a bit of a rape culture in the USA. Not surprisingly I try extremely hard to keep my "feminist" and "like to be raped" spheres very far apart. LOL

With you on this one.