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Author Topic: Fantasy, reality, and rape porn  (Read 691 times)
wjimmy
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« on: May 19, 2015, 12:56:28 AM »

The central distinction that’s usually drawn on erotic story sites is the one between reality and fantasy. I’d say that applies to Ravishu as well: the vast majority of the content here is text-based and most stories begin with a disclaimer along these lines: ‘This is only fantasy. I wouldn’t condone what happens in the story if it happened in real life.’ And I’m sure that’s true for the vast majority of story posters. So, for written erotica, the distinction between fantasy and reality holds up quite strongly, as far as I’m concerned.

But there seems to be a need for a third term, somewhere between fantasy and reality, when it comes to visual porn – especially video. To state the blindingly obvious, although most porn films are staged performances, and therefore essentially different from real life, they do involve real sex acts. Porn sex may be artificial and exaggerated in all sorts of ways — in the moans of the participants, for instance, or in the extreme duration of a fuck — but real penises or other objects are inserted into real human orifices in porn. Real sensations and emotions are therefore involved, even though they’re probably mediated by the artificiality of the context in which they’re filmed or photographed.
 
Which brings me to rape porn films: This isn’t a genre I’ve actively sought out, so I’ve only caught passing glimpses. But there seems to be general agreement on this site that filmed rape porn is usually unsatisfying because it’s tame and artificial. (Please correct me if I’m wrong there.) However, to film and distribute a real rape would, I assume, simply be horrific — and, therefore, entirely unacceptable.

I also assume that the simulated acts of what might be called ‘ethically acceptable’ rape porn do involve at least a degree of genuine physical and/or emotional discomfort for the victim. That may be a suffering one can assume the victim welcomes — as do ‘subs’ in BDSM productions, for example — but it still involves instances of pain, humiliation and degradation, however safe the filming environment may be. It’s that element of real sensation and emotion in even a simulated rape scene that makes me argue for a third term between fantasy, on the one hand, and reality, on the other, when it comes to visual porn.

I don’t really know where that leads me — and I suspect I may have done no more than state the obvious. But I’d be interested in other people’s thoughts on the fantasy/reality distinction where it comes to rape porn, and how that affects those of us who are drawn to representations of the subject in some way.  
 
« Last Edit: May 19, 2015, 05:18:39 PM by wjimmy » Logged
9ismine
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« Reply #1 on: May 20, 2015, 02:56:32 AM »

The central distinction that’s usually drawn on erotic story sites is the one between reality and fantasy. I’d say that applies to Ravishu as well: the vast majority of the content here is text-based and most stories begin with a disclaimer along these lines: ‘This is only fantasy. I wouldn’t condone what happens in the story if it happened in real life.’ And I’m sure that’s true for the vast majority of story posters. So, for written erotica, the distinction between fantasy and reality holds up quite strongly, as far as I’m concerned.

But there seems to be a need for a third term, somewhere between fantasy and reality, when it comes to visual porn – especially video. To state the blindingly obvious, although most porn films are staged performances, and therefore essentially different from real life, they do involve real sex acts. Porn sex may be artificial and exaggerated in all sorts of ways — in the moans of the participants, for instance, or in the extreme duration of a fuck — but real penises or other objects are inserted into real human orifices in porn. Real sensations and emotions are therefore involved, even though they’re probably mediated by the artificiality of the context in which they’re filmed or photographed.
 
Which brings me to rape porn films: This isn’t a genre I’ve actively sought out, so I’ve only caught passing glimpses. But there seems to be general agreement on this site that filmed rape porn is usually unsatisfying because it’s tame and artificial. (Please correct me if I’m wrong there.) However, to film and distribute a real rape would, I assume, simply be horrific — and, therefore, entirely unacceptable.

I also assume that the simulated acts of what might be called ‘ethically acceptable’ rape porn do involve at least a degree of genuine physical and/or emotional discomfort for the victim. That may be a suffering one can assume the victim welcomes — as do ‘subs’ in BDSM productions, for example — but it still involves instances of pain, humiliation and degradation, however safe the filming environment may be. It’s that element of real sensation and emotion in even a simulated rape scene that makes me argue for a third term between fantasy, on the one hand, and reality, on the other, when it comes to visual porn.

I don’t really know where that leads me — and I suspect I may have done no more than state the obvious. But I’d be interested in other people’s thoughts on the fantasy/reality distinction where it comes to rape porn, and how that affects those of us who are drawn to representations of the subject in some way.  
 


"Rape porn" doesn't do anything for me, and more than likely because of the reasons you've stated. For it to be satisfying and brutal enough to accommodate my thirst for the darkest of the dark, it would have to be extremely convincing. And "rape porn" is usually so poorly staged, or just so generic overall, that I exit out before the first couple of minutes are over. I pretty much feel the way you do. I don't know how I feel about this. I've never sought out the things I fantasize about, because to be honest, if I could find a video containing what I imagine in the bath tub or under my sheets it'd most certainly be illegal. And perhaps freak me out to access it. I definitely prefer reading rape stories rather than watching videos regarding my fetishes, because then I can make it however I want it to be and imagine it to be as brutal as I want. I rarely seek out videos anymore. Sometimes, imagery works, though. But as far as porn goes, the rape genre is trash.

Also, it's worth adding, I have found scenes from movies to be adequate. More so than "rape porn" they work for me because they are often convincing. For example, the scene from Girl with the Dragon Tattoo or The Last House on the Left turned me on right in the theater.
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wjimmy
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« Reply #2 on: May 26, 2015, 01:20:04 AM »

It strikes me that the 'third term' between fantasy and reality, that I mentioned above, already exists. It's hyperreality:

Quote
... hyperreality is an inability of consciousness to distinguish reality from a simulation of reality, especially in technologically advanced postmodern societies. Hyperreality is seen as a condition in which what is real and what is fiction are seamlessly blended together so that there is no clear distinction between where one ends and the other begins. It allows the co-mingling of physical reality with virtual reality (VR) and human intelligence with artificial intelligence (AI). Individuals may find themselves for different reasons, more in tune or involved with the hyperreal world and less with the physical real world.

SOURCE: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperreality

(Of course, that definition assumes that a single identifiable base reality exists - an idea that would be questioned by quite a few people nowadays.)

This, from reddit, sums up the relation between hyperreality and visual porn:

Quote
... the largest example of hyper-reality by far is pornography. it's sexuality, one of life's most intimate and sensory encompassing actions, being infinitely reduced to a virtual experience devoid of any sense beyond sight and sound. in pornography, you are not having sex with a partner or porn star, and you are not having sex with yourself; you are running a socially-conditioned simulation of an ideal of sex, a knowingly unobtainable object of desire that you virtually become attached to until you are satisfied, after which you are sucked back into the "unsatisfactory" reality of being naked in a room, alone.

SOURCE: http://www.reddit.com/r/NoFap/comments/yz223/porn_as_hyperreality/  

And this short, non-pornographic video about the modern conception of female beauty illustrates the 'hypering' of our current reality in a very concrete way, in my opinion:

http://www.nextnature.net/2007/03/simulacra-for-dummies/
« Last Edit: May 26, 2015, 01:45:38 AM by wjimmy » Logged
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« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2015, 09:31:47 PM »

I agree that rape porn, in general, is poorly acted and ridiculous, and frankly don't know who it's targeted at, since it seems to be consensus among rape enthusiasts that it does nothing for us.

But a good rape porn is quite achievable. And here I disagree with you, it's quite possible to have good rape scenes in which the "victim" didn't really suffer at all. It all depends on good acting and directing. There are many non-porn movies with rape scenes that are very realistic and enticing, some are even fap material (I once left a screening in the middle to go to the bathroom and relieve myself). Those aren't even real sex scenes, much less real suffering scenes.

On the other hand, a rape porn movie in which the victim was actually degraded/beaten/ravished, albeit consensually, is not unfeasible. Think of the more extreme S&M porn movies, women there are getting real physical abuse. Though I don't think that's necessary for rape.
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9ismine
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« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2015, 11:12:36 PM »

I agree that rape porn, in general, is poorly acted and ridiculous, and frankly don't know who it's targeted at, since it seems to be consensus among rape enthusiasts that it does nothing for us.

But a good rape porn is quite achievable. And here I disagree with you, it's quite possible to have good rape scenes in which the "victim" didn't really suffer at all. It all depends on good acting and directing. There are many non-porn movies with rape scenes that are very realistic and enticing, some are even fap material (I once left a screening in the middle to go to the bathroom and relieve myself). Those aren't even real sex scenes, much less real suffering scenes.

On the other hand, a rape porn movie in which the victim was actually degraded/beaten/ravished, albeit consensually, is not unfeasible. Think of the more extreme S&M porn movies, women there are getting real physical abuse. Though I don't think that's necessary for rape.
You've definitely made a good point.

Brutal physical abuse isn't the only element that constitutes a good rape scene.

For example humiliation, reluctant pleasure, and psychological defeat isn't too brutal for the screen but are some of the most appealing parts of rape.
I didn't consider this.
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